$2.24 million per word

bob_2 · 10-30-09 2:16 am

<blockquote><hr size=0><!-quote-!>quote:House health bill clocks in at 1,990 pages It runs more pages than War and Peace, has nearly five times as many words as the Torah, and its tables of contents alone run far longer than this story. The House health care bill unveiled Thursday clocks in at 1,990 pages and about 400,000 words. With an estimated 10-year cost of $894 billion, that comes out to about <center>$2.24 million per word.</center> ... <!-/quote-!><hr size=0></blockquote> <img src="http://www.atomorrow.net/discus/messages/14/2162.jpg" alt=""> The Culprits

don · 10-30-09 5:53 am

Maybe we should put up pictures of the currently uninsured sick and needy to show who the "culprits" will helping.

john8verse32 · 10-30-09 9:32 am

looks like Nancy P is wearing a Nancy P Halloween mask.....and expecting holiday handouts. and it will be treat for some, and trick for many... Question: will so many of other nations sick and needy come here that it overwhelms the new proposed give away system? Obama's aunt is already here...or at least was until she went underground..probably in Chicago....(she was outed thanks I think to a local Fox TV station!!!...thank God and Fox for fair and balanced info) living on welfare in a subsidized apartment in Boston, while under a judges order to go back to Africa...all at our collective expense. I recently met a mexican national who migrated undocumented to Mass 5-6 yrs ago for the construction industry..roofing... never got a green card..never learned English...and failed to hear OR UNDERSTAND his boss tell him ... .........."DON'T WALK OVER THERE" ....and fell 3 stories off a roof.... welfare and unemployment and workmans comp paid for his first few years, then a "good lawyer" sued the roofing company...claiming that they should have had a bilingual foreman to tell all the spanish speaking workers where not to step... the award for this guys illegal status and ignorance of English and failing to follow directions? 3 million....after his lawyer also got rich and is probably right now contributing re election funds to the Dems who oppose tort reform. today this mexican guy still doesnt speak English well, drives a nice motorized wheelchair in and out of an elevator van, owns a 350,000 home free and clear, with its own elevator...bought his wife her own home so she can live in california afreeing him to invite local (underemployed) women to visit him...when he's not wintering over in his legal homeland. all at our collective expense. I think the Indians had the worst immigration policy of all....they let US in!!! I think we should start listening to their complaints before we invite more immigrants. <img src="http://www.atomorrow.net/discus/messages/14/2165.jpg" alt=""> but we grow our own problems too... the Mexican is a real estate investor...that's how I met him...and he introduced me to one of his part time visitors who asked me to find her a welfare apartment.... her status: racially like Obama, never worked a day in her life, had already pumped out 8 kids which were adopted out by local authorities, and thanks to free abortion in supposedly Catholic Mass, was again preggers but hoped to be compensated for "giving away" the baby thru an illegal adoption lawyer, otherwise, was goin to get another abortion... and to support her crack and alcohol habit, did private "cleaning" jobs for 40$ per visit.... she enjoys the new Mass health package of free services....everything covered...from simple sniffles to hip replacement!!! any medicine is 2-6$/prescription.... so Lyrica, which is for nerves, which would cost you or me 70-80 dollars per week, costs her only 6..... guess who pays the rest..... and the new Dem proposal is based on the mass plan...where everybody is sposed to have insurance, and those who don't pay a "fine" which is less costly than paying for insurance... and those who can't afford it because all their money is invested in crack, or a nice SUV with spinning wheels so they can drive in style to pick up their welfare checks, they don't have to pay...the rest of us do. maybe I should buy some summer clothing, move to Saudi Arabia where everything is free thanks to stupid Americans buying angry Arab oil instead of drilling for their own. And after conversion to their 6th century belief...which is younger if not any more up to date than what I was taught, I might be entitled to my share of the worlds decreasing virgins later. even the Indians knew that "welfare" should be a temporary safety net, not a full time, full service Barco lounger for neerdowells, freeloaders, and political featherbedders..... speaking ow which...yesterday our wonderful Gov cut services and money to almost every program in Mass... except the free health care, and not a dime was cut from his budget to run his office.. which includes a political support staff who have no constitutional right to exist, but are his personal political friends... and over 10 of them are making over 100,000$ each of our tax dollars per year.... but its ingrained in our political system...the last three speakers of the Mass House of reps are either in jail or heading there for seeking bribes.

elaine · 10-30-09 12:51 pm

Evidently, only in the U.S. we are not our brother's keeper. No other industrialized nation refuses to consider that making health care available for all its citizens is one of the best investments; much better than the billions on useless wars with no results. Why is it that the military always gets nearly all it requests, while the citizens without adequate healthcare are refused? The rest of Europe sees us as an "uncaring Christian nation." They are the secular nations, yet care more for others.

elaine · 10-30-09 1:01 pm

Re “Swiss Model for Health Care Thrives Without Public Option” The most important aspect of the Swiss health care reforms is that Swiss insurance companies are nonprofit. The reforms enacted in 1994 forcing for-profit health insurers to become nonprofits were fiercely opposed by the insurance companies and one of the most contentious aspects of Swiss health care reform. It matters little whether reform in the United States involves a government-run option or the conversion of for-profit insurance companies into nonprofits (both would be equally contentious). The important thing is to get the profit motive out of health care. The United States is the only developed country that allows for-profit companies to eat up 20 cents of every premium dollar to provide insurance for basic health care. The French health care system, recently ranked by the World Health Organization as the best in the world, has overhead costs of only 5 percent. _________________________________________________ I guess the U.S. imagination is not all it's cracked up to be if even France can do it.

bob_2 · 10-30-09 6:21 pm

Don, "gullible" as usual, before you assume children will die, hopefully not by abortion, but have you read or heard anyone that has read the 1900 page document? I thought not. On Shawn Hannity's radio show he had a lady that had gotten into the bill over half way and things Obama says the law won't have, have, like having to give up your own insurance for the public opinion if benefits are changed in any way. There is more than the indigent at risk here, Don. Read up or at least reserve judgement until you know the facts. My post had to do with the cost of the bill when we all ready have several trillions dollars as our current deficit. Let's be frugal, but wise in what we put in that bill. The opposition wants several bills that would address: 1. Torte reform 2. The public option - and who will be mandate to opt for it. 3. The bill apparently includes fees for the doctor who orders services that are outside a certain norm. Such as, a doctor not deciding to do an MRI or a heart cath, or face a fine. I the patient would be wondering if that is the quality option or the doctor avoiding a fee for ordering what was best for me diagnosically.

elaine · 10-30-09 7:43 pm

Bob, should we assume that you (who do not read all that much, but does lots of copying and pasting), have read the entire bill? If so, please summarize it for those of us who have neither the time nor inclination to do so.

bob_2 · 10-31-09 6:21 am

That wasn't my point. I was talking about cost, Don was talking about content of the bill. To make statement about how poverty stricken kids will be effected before exploring content or reading reviews of the bill, will is the cart before the horse.

bob_2 · 10-31-09 6:24 am

Oh, Elaine, the reviewer also said Medicare benefits will be reduced. You will have to dip into that estate a little more if this bill goes into effect, eh??

elaine · 10-31-09 10:53 am

Bob, I already know that. If a form of Medicare can be extended to all, we all must share.

bob_2 · 10-31-09 5:10 pm

Elaine, when can I come out and share your estate, I'm a little low on cash right now???<img src="http://www.atomorrow.net/discus/clipart/lol.gif" border=0>

elaine · 10-31-09 9:26 pm

Is you broomstick in good condition for a flight tonight with the other witches? Tell me, are you prepared to turn down Medicare when you reach 65, or have you already started benfiting from it? I would love to see everyone in the U.S. have similar coverage as Medicare, and since it would include all ages and health conditions, it couldn't be as costly as Medicare for 65 years plus who have many more medical conditions. Why any civilized country would not offer healthcare, while policing more than half the world is despicable. Would you rather pay taxes to find WMD in Iraq, "establish democracy" in Afghanistan, or offer healthcare to all U.S. citizens. The latter is far more sure of success than Iraq and Afghanistan. It's your tax money at work and we have no choice in how its spent. That's up to our impotent and brain dead congress.

don · 11-01-09 9:15 am

"establish democracy" in Afghanistan, or offer healthcare to all U.S. citizens. The U.S., or the other Western Democracies, are not in Afghanistan for such altruistic reasons. If 9/11 had not happened, Afghanistan would still be as it was; including women terribly oppressed. But, because Islamic extremists finally got the attention of the "Great Satan" and because those extremists trained their forces in Afghanistan, now the Western Democracies, out of fear of future attacks, have moved in. Some of the Western Democracies with national health care programs have spilled their blood in Afghanistan along with their USA compatriots. .

elaine · 11-01-09 12:47 pm

Don, what IS the mission which NATO forces are attempting to accomplish in Afghanistan? If after 8 years it is more turmoil than ever, the largest supplier of heroin for the world, what has all the effort and money accomplished? We are not ensuring future attacks. In fact, we have managed to encourage more militants with our presence there. Like Vietnam, we will finally walk away, but hopefully not with a much larger body count. If the lessons of Vietnam have not been learned, it is evident that each new generation will continue repeating such useless, and costly (in lives and money) endeavors.

elaine · 11-01-09 12:52 pm

Why are we in Afghanistan?

don · 11-01-09 8:10 pm

Why are we in Afghanistan? I am not the one to answer that, of course. From my perch, I recall the "need" to go in and take out the Taliban. Afghanistan was a terrorist state. Its government ran training camps and exported their graduates to the USA. 9/11 illustrates the problem. Once the Taliban were defeated, a vacuum was created. Essentially, we remain in Afghanistan because the vacuum has not been adequately filled. The side benefit to NATO's presence in Afghanistan is the freedom enjoyed by its citizens, especially women. I see the situation in Afghanistan to be difficult. But, what choice did the USA, and its allies, have? We are not used to this kind of warfare. Give us another Second World War where the moral stand is more defensible??? Carpet bombing??? War is he??! I think it was Colin Powell who said: <a href="http://www.beirut-memorial.org/history/powell.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://www.atomorrow.net/discus/messages/14/2184.jpg" alt=""></a> .

elaine · 11-01-09 8:48 pm

But Powell was not heard when he spoke against military action, remember. If the U.S. has been totally unable to change the situation there, and now that Abdulla has ceded to Karzai, we no longer have any reason to be there, as the longer we stay, the more enemies we make as an occupier. Remember: the U.S. fought against British occupation a few hundred years ago and no nation or country loves an occupier that has out stayed his welcome. Our body counts will continue the longer we are there.

elaine · 11-01-09 8:53 pm

Gen. Shinsheki also spoke out against the war and was summarily replaced by a "yes" man. Gen.McChrystal's request for more troops is what generals must do: fight a military action. But the military there is now supposed to gain the "hearts and minds of the people" something soldiers have not trained to do. Gen McChyrstal is also the man in charge of lying about Pat Tilman's death by enemy fire when he knew immediately that he was killed by friendly fire, but his family finally discovered that he was used by the military to present a view that the family was most angry about.

don · 11-01-09 10:15 pm

we no longer have any reason to be there Except that Karzai wants NATO to stay. In fact, he fears an early departure. .

elaine · 11-01-09 11:05 pm

The condition there is not nearly as bad as in Somalia or Darfur and other countries. We seem to choose, willy-nilly, the countries where we engage in war. He should well fear the U.S. departure, because he knows he will not be able to control the worse violence that will follow. The police there are very undependable, as the soldiers testify.

don · 11-01-09 11:56 pm

We seem to choose, willy-nilly, the countries where we engage in war. The USA, or any other country, do not go to war out of altruism, usually. Afghanistan, under the Taliban, trained the terrorists who attacked America on 9/11. That doesn't seem very willy-nilly to me. .

elaine · 11-02-09 1:27 pm

Please read the official report: National Commission on Terrorist Attacks Upon the United States for the full story of those involved in this attack. They spent years in the U.S. in many states, in the Phillipines, Malaysia, and other countries. This is the official report of a full investigation.

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$2.24 million per word

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