Does The Geologic Column Prove Evolution?

bob_2 · 10-24-09 9:00 am

JAG has said as has John, Book of Rocks, suggest Geology has the answer to ancestry, WELL, if you like numbers like 0.2375 %: <blockquote><hr size=0><!-quote-!>quote:Does The Geologic Column Prove Evolution? by John D. Morris, Ph.D. Probably every textbook in use in America which in any way deals with evolutionary subjects includes a presentation of the "Geologic Column," or the "Geologic Time Scale" as it is sometimes called. This vertical display of the various geologic eras, periods, and epochs supposedly illustrates the nature of the fossil record, with recent fossils on the top and older ones on the bottom. By following the fossils from bottom to top, one can "see" evolution. Single-celled organisms evolve into marine invertebrates, which in turn evolve into fish. The fish eventually produce amphibians and then reptiles, which give way to birds and mammals and finally man. Surely, evolution is true if the fossils are arranged in such an order. Furthermore, each basic body style (phylum) has been present right from the start. In the lowest level of abundant multi-celled organisms, the Cambrian Period, fossils of each phylum has been found, including vertebrates! Many fossil organisms are found which have gone extinct, but no new body plans from the start. Did evolution stop at the start? Among the vertebrates, a case can be made for some change. Fish fossils are found in the Cambrian and people are not. However, people are vertebrates, as are dinosaurs and birds. In many ways, our skeletal features are comparable to that of a fish. We are certainly a whole lot more like a fish than we are to a coral, a clam, or a jellyfish. In addition, when you look at the geologic column in the textbook you will notice that is mainly a statement of vertebrate evolution, it has very little to say about the other fossil types. However, it is very constructive to look at all the fossils and then conclude. As it turns out, 95% of all fossils are shallow marine invertebrates, mostly shellfish. For instance, clams are found in the bottom layer, the top layer, and every layer in between. There are many different varieties of clams, but clams are in every layer and are still alive today. There is no evolution, just clams! The same could be said for corals, jellyfish, and many others. The fossil record documents primarily marine organisms buried in marine sediments, which (as discussed elsewhere) were catastrophically deposited. Of the 5% remaining fossils, 95% of them are algae and plant fossils (4.75% of the total). In that left over 5% of the 5%, insects and all other invertebrates make up 95% (0.2375 % of the total). ** All of the vertebrate fossils considered together, (fish, amphibians, reptiles, birds, and mammals), comprise only 0.0125% of the entire fossil record, and only 1% of these, or .000125% of the total, consist of more than a single bone! Almost all of them come from the Ice Age. Surely, the vertebrate fossil record is far from complete. Where we have a good record, no evolution can be seen. For the very scanty vertebrate record, an evolutionary story can be told, but the facts do not support it, and certainly do not prove it. *Dr. John Morris is the President of ICR. ** Paleontologist Dr. Kurt Wise provided these figures. <!-/quote-!><hr size=0></blockquote>

john8verse32 · 10-24-09 9:45 pm

Does The Geologic Column Prove Evolution? maybe not biological evolution in some eyes.... and anyway, it is mostly the study of geology, not biology that one studies layer by layer in the geological column.... unless one finds fossils or burrows, or other evidence of life. and when you do find life, the deepest layers tend to provide the simplest life forms, while the most complex life forms are found as fossils nearer the top most layers. but what the Geological Columne does do is DISPROVE the instant, fiat lux creation we all grew to love in SS classes. even the rocks have evolved!!! and over huge periods of time. many revolutions of the sun around our earth. God or mother nature started with magma being extruded from the earth..thats melted rocks, oozing up from inside a molten earth. it piled /rose up as granite mountains, taking a long time to grow, then time to cool.... all becoming weathered by natures freeze/thaw cycle, and eroded by precipitation, and gravity does the rest erosion produces sand and or mud which the precip washes down into the nearby valleys more erosion, produces more layers on top the sand under pressure cements into to sandstone, and the mud compresses to mudstone. later tectonic forces bury the sandstone and mudstones deeper, or ply more layers on top, so the pressure of overlying layers and heat of the earth can metamorphize the sandstone into gneiss, and the mudstone into shale, then harder slate, then even harder schist after even more pressure and heat of burial. so gneiss and schist are evolutionary products of very long term multiple natural forces and events. limestone starts as live animals living in a shallow sea...shallow, because many derive their power from the sun....they grow, eat, breath Oxy, ingest calcium, have babies, grow shells, then die, and when the algae or plankton die, they sink to the bottom, and become a calcite ooze from their shells.... after the pressure of more layers on top, and tectonic forces raising the ooze to the surface, it dries out and becomes limestone. when later earth forces bury limestone deeply, the extreme heat and pressure of deep in the earth changes/cooks limestone into marble, with tectonic forces sometimes "marbling" the marble into the swirls and patterns sometimes characteristic of marble ice cream. so marble is an evolutionary product of natural earth and biological events over prolonged periods of time, both schist and marble are proof from the geological column that evolution has occured...at least in the rocks...and the time frame wildly exceeds the biblical chronology. the goatherders didn't know their schist from their marbles. what they did know from their environment was sandstone...which blows in the wind into deserts.. and mudstones which blows up into dust... and pockets of limestone, such as Golgotha. fitting, no? that our story of Jesus on the cross was on a hill created eons prior, by gigabeyons of tiny, ancient marine animals, who died long ago to make the limestone hill....as well as the limestone cave He was temporarily buried in...and the alabaster box the womens perfume came in...as well as the limestone box recently purported to be the burial vault of brother James.... fitting also? that many of the monumental buildings in Silver Springs are covered in limestone or marble? dead animals, mega years ago,sunk to the bottom, and compressed under massive pressures and intense heat, changed into marble quietly cloking the sda monuments to scientific ignorance?...ignorance in the usage of choosing to ignore.... limestone proves death before the Edenic "fall". gneiss, schist, and marble prove that the rocks have evolved. and radio dating proves that it has happened over a way, way longer time frame than Sister White was given visions to explain. in addition, underground coal fires do NOT cause vulcanism. and I bet there are no tall, majestic people living without sin (or oxygen) on Jupiter. but my mother and EGW were right when they promised that you could go blind....ah, if you didn't stop...ah, jumping at EGW's unsuportable conclusions. Thank modern medicine for cataract surgury to correct a design flaw that allows blue eyes to burn in too much sunlight...

bob_2 · 10-25-09 8:57 am

and when you do find life, the deepest layers tend to provide the simplest life forms, while the most complex life forms are found as fossils nearer the top most layers. John, in case of flood who runs to the highest ground and who lives in the lowest underwater places, DAH!!!

john8verse32 · 10-25-09 9:25 am

here is the ultimate explanation of the geological column....by a former YEC.... <a href="http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/geocolumn/" target=_top>http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/geocolumn/</a>

elaine · 10-25-09 8:09 pm

I worked for an oil-drilling company for a year in Louisiana, where there was once a large very affluent town, where the East Texas oilmen lived. The geologist was the most important part of the team as it was he who made the decision of where and how deep to drill. He would come back into the office frequently from the site and report on the various layers they had reached, signifying where the probability of oil would be discovered. They, along with those in the antarctic who drill for ice cores (recently shown on TV), have gone down to 800,000 years and still drilling. It becomes more difficult with these discoveries to contend for YEC when confronted with such overwhelming discoveries. Also, the recent find in Africa of an even older "Eve" puts the YEC people on alert to present yet another opposing view. They must diligently study to offset such findings.

elaine · 10-25-09 8:16 pm

Researchers Find Earliest Evidence for Animal Life Discovered fossil animal steroids date back to more than 635 million years ago, says UC Riverside’s Gordon Love (February 4, 2009) NEWS MEDIA CONTACT Name: Iqbal Pittalwala Tel: (951) 827-6050 E-mail: <a href="mailto:iqbal@ucr.edu">iqbal@ucr.edu</a> EnlargeSponges are one of the simplest forms of multicellular animals. RIVERSIDE, Calif. – An international team of scientists from UC Riverside, the Massachusetts Institute of Technology and other institutions has found the oldest evidence for animals in the fossil record. The researchers examined sedimentary rocks in south Oman, and found an anomalously high amount of distinctive steroids that date back to 635 million years ago, to around the end of the last immense ice age. The steroids are produced by sponges – one of the simplest forms of multicellular animals. The researchers argue that the discovery of the sponges is evidence for multicellular animal life beginning 100 million years before the Cambrian explosion, a well-studied and unique episode in Earth history that began about 530 million years ago when, as indicated by the fossil record, animal life diversified rapidly.

don · 10-26-09 7:24 am

The Geological Timescale <a href="http://www.pir.sa.gov.au/minerals/education/geological_timescale" target=_top>http://www.pir.sa.gov.au/minerals/education/geological_timescale</a> <img src="http://www.atomorrow.net/discus/messages/16/2101.jpg" alt=""><img src="http://www.atomorrow.net/discus/messages/16/2102.jpg" alt=""> Compare this with an earlier post of the Grand Canyon and the Geologic Column at: <a href="http://www.atomorrow.net/cgi-bin/discus/show.cgi?tpc=6&post=7424#POST7424" target="_blank">http://www.atomorrow.net/cgi-bin/discus/show.cgi?tpc=6&post=7424#POST7424</a> (Message edited by Don on October 26, 2009)

john8verse32 · 10-26-09 10:30 am

I think we've finally discovered why the "meshweb of science" can be so convincing....when everything comes together. Look at the geocolumn above, and note that it was divided into periods based on fossils..... on a relative time scale....with the lowest layers understood to contain the oldest materials and also containing the least developed life forms. The scale was originally only relative, with no actual data available for measuring such long time scales until the invention of radiometric dating. for example, the cretaceous era (in german, spelled with a "K") differed from the following tertiary age by an abrupt disappearance of many lifeforms in the strata. This "mass extinction" was obvious, but for a long time it had no know cause. It took several branches of science to come together in a meshing web of knowledge and discovery to explain it. The discovery that iridium was found in extra quantities near this K/T boundary was the beginning of a new understanding that the earth hasnot been in the slow, steady state of uniformitarianism that lyell had taught... Astronomy began to show that there were possible extra terrestrial potential interruptions in earthhistory, and therefore in life on earth, and the search for oil by Mexico's national oil company drilled the astonishing finding from deep underground. God or Mother Nature sometimes bowls errant space rocks at us. and a big one cratered the Yucatan about 65 million yrs ago,according to radiometric data, spewing iridium,which is in abundance in space rocks, around the world, but in higher concentrations closer to the impact site. and this is where the "meshweb" of science begins to show how it works. Astronomy, geology, and radio dating come together with a potentially astonishing "hypothesis" in this chart: the Shiva Hypothesis.... <img src="http://www.atomorrow.net/discus/messages/16/2105.gif" alt=""> note that at the K?T boundary, 65 myo, there are two potentially related events.... theChixulub impact and on the opposite side of the world, the Deccan Traps, a massive volcanic event. Running the motion picture backwards of the moving continents, plate tectonic geologists suggest that india was at the earth's precise opposite of the Yucatan impact...and that the latter may have caused the volcanism...and between the two events, much of life on earth disappeared....including the dinos....buried under the iridium layer!!!! nothing to do with the goatherders legendary flood. nothing to do with the hot women consorting with space aliens as claimed by Genesis, andnothing to do with amalgamation of man and beast, as suggested by EGW, and claimed by David Read over on Spectrum forum. a closer look at the graph shows a periodicity of events, as well as a confluence of impacts AND volcanic events. whatcould have caused this? could this be the reason behind periodic mass extinctions and earth catastrophes? and what is in our future!!!!

john8verse32 · 10-26-09 11:57 am

Michael Rampino's Shiva Hypothesis is based on the combination of the +/- 30 million year astronomical periodicity of the solar systems dance up and down thru the galactic plane, which maybe at the basis for the similar 30 my periodicity of impacts, which seem to be combined with major vulcanism, both of which may have combined to produce major geologic and extinction events in earth history. here's the google search: <a href="http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&source=hp&q=shiva+hypothesis&aq=f&oq=&aqi=g-m1" target=_top>http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&source=hp&q=shiva+hypothesis&aq=f&oq=&aqi=g-m1</a> with details: <a href="http://www.springerlink.com/content/j0204x4768353r20/" target=_top>http://www.springerlink.com/content/j0204x4768353r20/</a> and the article: Michael R. Rampino and Bruce M. Haggerty Earth Systems Group, New York University, 10003 New York, New York Abstract The Shiva Hypothesis , in which recurrent, cyclical mass extinctions of life on Earth result from impacts of comets or asteroids, provides a possible unification of important processes in astrophysics, planetary geology, and the history of life. Collisions with Earth-crossing asteroids and comets a few km in diameter are calculated to produce widespread environmental disasters (dust clouds, wildfires), and occur with the proper frequency to account for the record of five major mass extinctions (from 108 Mt TNT impacts) and ~ 20 minor mass extinctions (from 107–108 Mt impacts) recorded in the past 540 million years. Recent studies of a number of extinctions show evidence of severe environmental disturbances and mass mortality consistent with the expected after-effects (dust clouds, wildfires) of catastrophic impacts. At least six cases of features generally considered diagnostic of large impacts (e.g., large impact craters, layers with high platinum-group elements, shock-related minerals, and/or microtektites) are known at or close to extinction-event boundaries. Six additional cases of elevated iridium levels at or near extinction boundaries are of the amplitude that might be expected from collision of relatively low-Ir objects such as comets. The records of cratering and mass extinction show a correlation, and might be explained by a combination of periodic and stochastic impactors. The mass extinction record shows evidence for a periodic component of about 26 to 30 Myr, and an ~ 30 Myr periodic component has been detected in impact craters by some workers, with recent pulses of impacts in the last 2–3 million years, and at ~ 35, 65, and 95 million years ago. A cyclical astronomical pacemaker for such pulses of impacts may involve the motions of the Earth through the Milky Way Galaxy. As the Solar System revolves around the galactic center, it also oscillates up and down through the plane of the disk-shaped galaxy with a half-cycle ~ 30±3 Myr. This cycle should lead to quasi-periodic encounters with interstellar clouds, and periodic variations in the galactic tidal force with maxima at times of plane crossing. This galactic carrousel effect may provide a viable perturber of the Oort Cloud comets, producing periodic showers of comets in the inner Solar System. These impact pulses, along with stochastic impactors, may represent the major punctuations in earth history. also at NASA, Goddard Institute for Space Studies, 2880 Broadway, New York, New York 10025. Michael Paine continues the explanation with plenty of links (meshwebs!!) <a href="http://users.tpg.com.au/users/tps-seti/crater.html" target=_top>http://users.tpg.com.au/users/tps-seti/crater.html</a> Look at the other charts here: <a href="http://users.tpg.com.au/users/tps-seti/crater.html#impacts_volcanoes" target=_top>http://users.tpg.com.au/users/tps-seti/crater.html#impacts_volcanoes</a> and you find that there are both extraterrestrial and geological events seemingly related in time, and often associated with impacts resulting in antipodal volcanism... and all seeming to coincide with the 30 million year period of the solar systems periodic wandering thru the galaxy. There's also a theory that impacts deep into the planet might have caused "hotspots"...including an impact into Siberia which may have generated the hawaiian Archepelego hotspot (its lava is higher in iridium than many other volcanic lavas!!!) about 35 myo there are two recorded minor impacts on the opposite side of the globe from major volcanism, but no currently suggested major corresponding extinction... 65 myo, or slightly more than 2 sets of 30 million year , is the major ET event...showing both the major impact in Chixulub, and the corresponding antipodal volcanism in India which at the time, was in the southern hemisphere by known plate tectonic history. 144 myo, you have the Sudan volcanism correlating with three major impacts....and that's relatively close to 5 x 30 million years...and it coincides with the jurrasic/cretaceous extinction, which scientists suggest paved the way for the rise of the dinos. and 210 (7 x 30) and 250 (8+x30) million years ago were other major mass extinctions found in the geological column, which can now possibly be related to astronomical events. so if we chart the 30 million year period, we are overdue for the really big one!!! unless a couple of little ones 2 myo were small duds in the cycle. either way, God could be paying more attention to His Space junk... <img src="http://www.atomorrow.net/discus/messages/16/2110.jpg" alt=""> forget the four horsemen of the apocalypse!!! God or Mother Nature could put an end to all our speculation about whether Judas hanged himself or his insides fell out, by bowling random space junk at us which has been careening around the universe in periodic ways with our earth's name (non)divinely emblazoned on it. gives new daffynishion to the suggestion to "keep looking up"...at "12 oclock high" ...its the "Hun in the sun" who will get you. the one you don't see coming. one can choose to believe that the universe is what it is, and that science can help us understand it by the study of rocks, and stars, and gravity, and radioactive decay, and the progression of life forms as shown in the layers of earths rocks....and how volcanoes are NOT caused by underground coal fires... <img src="http://www.atomorrow.net/discus/messages/16/2111.jpg" alt=""> or some can justify continuing to have faith in the shepherds tale that the sun can be stopped in its daily rotation of the earth in order for their loving god to help them kill more neighbors, take their land and stuff, and use their virgins. the choice seems to be between a hope to understand things now, by not limiting our studies to what ancient shepherds did nor did not know, and make this a better place for us and our kids futures, or sacrifice curiosity, knowledge, and possibly truth now, for hoped for shepherds pie in the sky and all the answers later while limiting lifes search to the creationist method...googling up web sites which prove what one already believes. <img src="http://www.atomorrow.net/discus/messages/16/2112.jpg" alt=""> maybe its like the Spanish song... mas alla del sol. far beyond the sun. beyond the (non-existent) EGW claimed hole in Orion where there are said to be mansions being constructed for trubelievers, but which, alas, are 1,600 years way if UPS delivery (Universal Parcel Service) is limited to the speed of light. But I wanna know NOW!!! cause despite an EGW approved semi-vegi diet, good genes, wearing my seat belt, and having never learned sodomy, or how to make crack, and having fore sworn fast women and faster motorcycles (well, at least the Rice Rockets) and given up many of Gods natural products such as alcohol, funky mushrooms, and the wrong kind of grass, and altho I'm planning on living forever, and so far its working.... I may not have 1,600yrs to wait.

don · 10-28-09 7:46 am

Worlds Apart <img src="http://www.atomorrow.net/discus/messages/16/2126.jpg" alt=""> I was searching through Google Books for further viewpoints on the Geological Column. I came across a book by Scott M. Huse called The Collapse of Evolution. The graph above describes the user ratings for Huse's book. Not surprising, but quite interesting. <a href="http://www.amazon.com/Collapse-Evolution-Scott-M-Huse/dp/0801043840" target="_blank"><img src="http://www.atomorrow.net/discus/messages/16/2127.jpg" alt=""></a> Click on picture for Amazon.com .

john8verse32 · 10-28-09 8:37 am

it clearly shows that there are two sides to the argument!!!! nothing in the middle. but the first three reviews tell the story about how ignorant the book is....meaning, half the respondents who gave the 5 star rating may also be ignorant!!! (according to the other half!!) reviews: 1.0 out of 5 stars No creationist argument too stupid for inclusion, December 21, 2007 By Darby M'Graw (Treasure Island) - See all my reviews This review is from: Collapse of Evolution, The (Paperback) Huse has compiled a large array of creationist arguments. Apparently no argument was so stupid or so thoroughly discredited that it was turned away. Huse was apparently unable or unwilling to critically analyze the material himself. Credit is given to his various creationist sources, many times to Duane Gish and Henry Morris. This is the old school "Creation Science" creationism of the 1970s and 1980s, not your modern hoity-toity high-brow (by comparison) "Intelligent Design" creationism in disguise. As one expects in a creationist book, Huse quote-mines with abandon, taking comments from real scientists out of context and twisting them to fit. Watch out for those deadly ellipses. No argument turned away! It's all in here. Radioactive dating is not accurate: page 18 (page numbers from Baker Books reprint of 1988) Earth's magnetic field is decaying: page 21. Exponential population growth would have flooded the globe with humans: page 27 (because it is inconceivable that human population numbers would have been held in check by disease and predation). Discussion of Biblical "kinds": page 38. Absence of transitional fossils: page 41. that one was shot down over 140 years ago. The bombardier beetle: pages 77-80. Some things in the book are so stupid they are astounding. On page 43, Huse states that according to evolutionary theory, humans descended from birds. Wowie zowie, that's stupid! On page 109-110, Huse presents the duck-billed platypus and insists that scientists claim it as a transitional form between birds and mammals. How can Huse criticize evolution when he clearly does not even understand it? (Brief educational moment: the "duck-bill" of the platypus is a unique adaptive structure, and bears no relation to the actual bill of a duck.) Pages 16-18: Human and dinosaur fossil footprints found alongside each other. This one is so stupid that even other creationists have criticized it.And that's saying something. Chapter 7 lists scientists who believe in Biblical creationism, including (page 119) Dr. Dennis Gabor, "The 1971 winner of the Nobel Peace Prize in science." The what? Gabor won a Nobel for physics, not for peace. And the topic was holography, so even if Gabor supported creationism (I don't know or care) why would I look to him for expertise on evolution? One bright spot: Chapter 8 includes a considerate listing of scientific issues on which a literal reading of the Bible differs from the evolutionary viewpoint. Anyone with enough honesty to track down the evidence and put some effort into understanding what it really means can use this as a guide for rejecting a literal reading of the creation myths in the book of Genesis. Finally, what is the single stupidest argument for creationism? Huse includes it on page 45. Usually it is presented with monkeys, but Huse uses coelacanth for variety. I will paraphrase, "If we are descended from coelacanth, why are there still coelacanth?" 9 of 13 people found the following review helpful: 1.0 out of 5 stars Another load of tosh!, January 4, 2007 By D. Huang "arvay" (Fairbanks, AK, United States) - See all my reviews (REAL NAME) This review is from: Collapse of Evolution, The (Paperback I did purchase and begin to read this book with a completely open mind; I was genuinely curious about what this "Intelligent Design" stuff was all about. I was utterly disappointed to find that this book is a bunch of ignorant tripe, full of poorly-supported opinions argued with possibly the WORST logic skills I have been astonished to encounter. If you are interested in how life has come into being and how it came to be the way it is today, by all means, I suggest conventional science as the first step. If you are interested in religion, philosophy, and the spiritual side of nature, I suggest conventional religion as the first step. I must conclude that "Intelligent Design" is a trashy attempt to disguise the latter as the former, which ends up being horrible at presenting either. This is such irritating trash. I was completely incapable of finishing even the first chapter, and I am a compulsive reader who will read almost anything (like the cereal box, over and over, or even trashy supermarket tabloids when I am waiting in line!). I could not even bear to donate it to the library, as I usually do with books I've finished, because I could not bear the thought of passing it on. I had to dump it into the recycle bin. 1.0 out of 5 stars What was he smoking ?, September 30, 2009 By Michael Sloane "MikeS" (Melbourne, Australia) - See all my reviews What a load of unmitigated tripe ! As another reviewer stated, (mis)quote mining at its best. This surely demonstrates the dishonesty associated with these lunatic young earth 'creationist' types. "Lying for Jesus" at its best. Its not evolution that has collapsed, rather 'creationist' integrity. Whatever he was smoking, its powerful stuff. Save your money and go for a good read - maybe one of Richard Dawkins sensible and properly argued books. The only reason it has one star is that the review would accept unless it had at least one.

jag · 10-28-09 10:23 pm

Don, You certainly love reading (so do I!), so may I suggest another title? It won't be creationist apologetic, or a "New Atheist" rejection of religion. How about a marriage of science and religion instead? I'd be interested in your thoughts about Michael Dowd's "Thank God for Evolution". Dowd does not try to prove evolution there, but rather attempts to bridge and unite knowledge and faith.

don · 10-28-09 11:02 pm

Jag, I will look into Dowd's work. I have heard of it before, but no first hand information. Thanks. .

cadge · 11-19-09 11:46 am

As I was reading through Michael Rampino's Shiva Hypothesis and John's comments, <a href="http://www.atomorrow.net/cgi-bin/discus/show.cgi?tpc=16&post=7548#POST7548" target=_top>http://www.atomorrow.net/cgi-bin/discus/show.cgi?t pc=16&post=7548#POST7548</a> it occurred to me that as each of these impacts occurred, was it not possible for them to have adjusted the earths orbit a little each time and our gravity and atmospheric pressure also? Could this have caused the extinction of the Dinosaurs? Was the gravity "heavier" at one time long ago and that is why the dinosaurs were of such stout bone construction and heavier hydes;in order that they could exist counter to the heavy downward extreme of the gravity? Even the plant life and climate was affected? Did the air become thinner? was the mixture of gasses altered? Better yet, were we created of the dust of the earth here or created elsewhere and placed here? In a lab maybe? Are we "The Human Experiment"? Were many "prototypes" developed, thus the difference in races and features? Through the bible can we see that a body of people were sought to learn to live in harmony despite their differences and recognize that there can only be one system of Government? And a people that will come to the understanding that they are to live for others employing their talents in a spirit of giving rather than taking, and as each does this they have the peaceful knowledge that as others perform in harmony that it perpetuates life to all and glorifies the author of this life/love system? They have come to know that trusting the foundational structure of the originator of the system in that it is the best way for all? You can't have true love without order and co-operation. It's a co-dependent society. But it is not a world without choices as the depiction in the "Garden" metaphor of the many trees that we are freely offered to eat from. I gotta go for my walk. Cadge

john8verse32 · 11-19-09 4:58 pm

<a href="http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2001/08/0820_moonimpact.html" target=_top>http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2001/08/08 20_moonimpact.html</a>

john8verse32 · 11-20-09 9:41 am

I didn't have time yesterday to explain the above link.... but it represents the current thinking of scientists.. that the earth WAS hit in a major way, some 3-4 billion years ago..by a collision with a small planet which set us spinning on our tilted angle, providing us with seasons, and the heat from the impact melted all the rocks, allowing the heavy metals, iron and nickel, to concentrate at the center core, spinning differently than the surface, thus creating the magnetosphere. the melted earth evaporated any argon gas in the magma, so as rocks cooled and potassium decayed at a now known rate, the argon was often trapped in crystals of rock, which today can be measured, indicating the ancient age of the rock via the potassium-argon method. the heat of the interior, caused both by radioactive decay, AND the residual heat from that impact is responsible for the plate tectonics now known to cause mountains and volcanoes, not underground coal fires as believed by some in Sister Whites daze. And while there probably are no planetesimals headed our way any longer, there still is a lot of space junk out there flying around in potentially earth crossing orbits, or in orbits which could be influenced by the mass of Jupiter which could either protect us by attracting to itself many asteroids...like the Shoemaker-Levy impact a few yrs ago, or Jupiter could swing junk into new orbits which menace the earth. there are several interesting things about the Shiva Hypothesis which tie up a number of loose ends: the periodicity, and the potential that major impacts may have resulted in massive volcanism at earth antipodes, causing major extinctions in the distant past. oh, ya... and the notion that the periodicity comes in multiples of about 30 Million Years, and its been 65 MY since the last earth shattering big one...and about 30 MY since the last suspected smaller event scientists are supposing in the Chesapeake Bay, so we may be over due for another ET impact... either way, its beginning to look as tho God does not have time in this wide universe to control the movements of everything... <img src="http://www.atomorrow.net/discus/messages/16/2277.jpg" alt=""> unless....horror the thought...He did it on purpose 65 myo to kill off the dinos, and give humans a chance to evolve...to worship him by massacring innocent animals by the hundreds of thousands just at Salomon's temple dedication <a href="http://www.spectrummagazine.org/articles/sabbath_school/2009/11/15/reddish_cow_provision_purification" target=_top>http://www.spectrummagazine.org/articles/sabbath_school/2009/11/15/reddish_cow_provision_purification</a>

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#1 10-24-09 9:00 am

Does The Geologic Column Prove Evolution?

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#9 10-26-09 11:57 am

Re: Does The Geologic Column Prove Evolution?

#10 10-28-09 7:46 am

Re: Does The Geologic Column Prove Evolution?

#11 10-28-09 8:37 am

Re: Does The Geologic Column Prove Evolution?

#12 10-28-09 10:23 pm

Re: Does The Geologic Column Prove Evolution?

#13 10-28-09 11:02 pm

Re: Does The Geologic Column Prove Evolution?

#14 11-19-09 11:46 am

Re: Does The Geologic Column Prove Evolution?

#15 11-19-09 4:58 pm

Re: Does The Geologic Column Prove Evolution?

#16 11-20-09 9:41 am

Re: Does The Geologic Column Prove Evolution?

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