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why worry about global warming...if God or the universe is going go bowl a strike at us anyway... <BR> <BR>remember what happened to the dinos? <BR> <BR>could it happen to us? <BR> <BR><a href="http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=CNG.783c3aae6eb418393fc6f8c443ef6765.2f1&show_article=1" target=_top>http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=CNG.783c3a ae6eb418393fc6f8c443ef6765.2f1&show_article=1</a> <BR> <BR>An asteroid of a similar size to a rock that exploded above Siberia in 1908 with the force of a thousand atomic bombs whizzed close past Earth on Monday, astronomers said on Tuesday. <BR>2009 DD45, estimated to be between 21 and 47 meters (68 and 152 feet) across, raced by at 1344 GMT on Monday, the Planetary Society and astronomers' blogs reported. <BR> <BR>The gap was just 72,000 kilometers (44,750 miles), or a fifth of the distance between Earth and the Moon and only twice the height of satellites in geosynchronous orbit, the website space.com said. <BR> <BR>The estimated size is similar to that of an asteroid or comet that exploded above Tunguska, Siberia, on June 30 1908, flattening 80 million trees in a swathe of more than 2,000 square kilometres (800 square miles). <BR> <BR>2009 DD45 was spotted last Saturday by astronomers at the Siding Spring Survey in Australia, and was verified by the International Astronomical Union's Minor Planet Centre (MPC), which catalogues Solar System rocks. <BR> <BR>The closest flyby listed by the MPC is 2004 FU162, a small asteroid about six metres (20 feet) across which came within about 6,500 kms (4,000 miles) of us in March 2004.
If electricity comes from electrons, does morality come from morons?
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whole galaxies are crashing into each other... <BR> <BR>and we once thought the universe was benignly created just for us, and was under intelligent control? <BR> <BR><a href="http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/03/090317125130.htm" target=_top>http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/03/09031 7125130.htm</a> <BR> <BR>ScienceDaily (Mar. 17, 2009) — <BR> <BR><font color="0000ff">A new image from NASA's Spitzer Space Telescope offers a rare view of an imminent collision between the cores of two merging galaxies, each powered by a black hole with millions of times the mass of the sun. <BR> <BR>The galactic cores are in a single, tangled galaxy called NGC 6240, located 400-million light years away in the constellation Ophiuchus. Millions of years ago, each core was the dense center of its own galaxy before the two galaxies collided and ripped each other apart. Now, these cores are approaching each other at tremendous speeds and preparing for the final cataclysmic collision. They will crash into each other in a few million years, a relatively short period on a galactic timescale.</font>
If electricity comes from electrons, does morality come from morons?
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That can easily be explained. <BR> <BR>See, since the stars were only created 6000 years ago this must be part of the light God put near the earth that only looks like it happened. This never occurred, and therefore is a mirage in the minds of evilutionists. These are not BLOWING UP. It appears that way but if you actually believe it its been put into your mind by the satanic scientists. <BR> <BR> <img src="http://www.atomorrow.net/discus/clipart/biggrin.gif" border=0>
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Check out this story also about the new bacteria from the stratosphere: <BR> <BR><a href="http://www.cnn.com/2009/TECH/science/03/17/india.bacteria/index.html" target=_top>http://www.cnn.com/2009/TECH/science/03/17/india.b acteria/index.html</a>
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more massively colliding galaxies..... <BR> <BR>is anybody (anything) out there controlling these things? <BR> <BR>or are random processes of nature working out of chaos theory? <BR> <BR>meaning, all those Pslams about the Eternal One controlling the heavens might be based on old , astronomically ignorant superstitions? <BR> <BR>check out the slow motion (from our standpoint) collision of rapidly moving (from their standpoint) space objects here: <BR> <BR><a href="http://www.astronomy.com/asy/default.aspx?c=a&id=8017" target=_top>http://www.astronomy.com/asy/default.aspx?c=a&id=8 017</a> <BR> <BR><font color="0000ff">The European Space Observatory's (ESO) Very Large Telescope (VLT) has taken the best image ever of a strange and chaotic duo of interwoven galaxies. The images also contain some surprises - interlopers both far and near. <BR> <BR>Sometimes objects in the sky that appear strange, or different from normal, have a story to tell and prove rewarding scientifically. This was the idea behind Halton Arp's catalog of Peculiar Galaxies that appeared in the 1960s. One of the oddballs listed there is Arp 261, which has now been imaged in more detail than ever before using the FORS2 instrument on ESO's VLT. The image contains several surprises. <BR> <BR>Arp 261 lies about 70 million light-years distant in the constellation Libra. Its chaotic and unusual structure is created by the interaction of two galaxies that are engaged in a slow motion, but highly disruptive close encounter. Although individual stars are unlikely to collide in such an event, the huge clouds of gas and dust crash into each other at high speed, leading to the formation of bright new clusters of hot stars that are seen in the picture. The paths of the existing stars in the galaxies are also disrupted, creating the faint swirls extending to the upper left and lower right of the image</font>
If electricity comes from electrons, does morality come from morons?
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A picture is worth a thousand words: <BR> <BR><img src="http://www.atomorrow.net/discus/messages/16/994.gif" alt="">
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And again, but from an IDiot view: <BR> <BR><img src="http://www.atomorrow.net/discus/messages/16/997.jpg" alt="">
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TTTHTFAL
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Now here is a guy that is thinking, and realizing the delicate nature of our environment for life: <BR> <BR><a href="http://digg.com/d1iXyS" target=_top>http://digg.com/d1iXyS</a>
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I watched the video twice and he is talking about <b>A</b> god of the Big Bang. <BR> <BR>That's the Deist god of George Washington, Thomas Paine, Thomas Jefferson, and Benjamin Franklin. The god that just lit the fuse and has never been heard from again. <BR> <BR>He could also be speaking about one of the Hindu gods that created the earth, according to Hindu texts, about 4.3 billion years ago. <BR> <BR>Its definitely not THE <b>G</b>od that the goat herders believed in and you believe in. <BR> <BR>If you can deduce something else in his talk please give the time in the video and I'll watch it again. <BR> <BR>The problem with that line of argument (there had to be a god to do something sometime way back when cause it couldn't have happened by itself) begs the question of "Who created this god?".
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Try this, and before you reject it out of hand, remember science is a manmade device, and has by it's own definitions excluded anything transcendant. So does it have a right to even speculate about origins and a God: <BR> <BR><a href="http://www.christiananswers.net/q-aig/aig-c039.html" target=_top>http://www.christiananswers.net/q-aig/aig-c039.htm l</a>
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he even said he doesn't believe in "Creationism"... <BR> <BR>he said it would have been better if a God had been involved to have created the acorn, and then let it grow into a tree.... rather than create trees.... <BR> <BR>so the "god" he is talking about as a possibility, is NOT the God of the Hebrews, who called things into existance, and killed off those of his creatures who didn't worship Him the right way.... <BR> <BR>in addition the speaker talks about the earth being just "right" for life..... <BR> <BR>This concept includes the idea that life exists because we receive sunlight which powers the whole process, plus we have the right kind of air to breath, we have a metabolism which uses water and Oxygen which is plentiful... <BR> <BR>however...not many years back, deep sea exploration has discovered life forms which do not rely on either sun nor air!! andwhich live in boiling water, under tons of pressure... actually living off the heat of the earth, and working on a sulfer cycle, not an oxygen cycle... <BR> <BR>thekinds of "animals" which Adam and Eve neverknew about, and could not have been among "all the animals" named as claimed in the ancient story.
If electricity comes from electrons, does morality come from morons?
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anyway, if Bruce Willis or God don't do something, and if gravity works its magic, our grandkids could be in trouble on (begin quote) <BR> <BR><font color="0000ff">the 13th, April, 2029: <BR>If you're superstitious, this might not be a good day to schedule a near-Earth asteroid encounter. But, as it happens, that's the day that the Near Earth Asteroid (NEA) Apophis will make a very close flyby of Earth–a once in 800 years event for an asteroid Apophis' size. <BR> <BR>Fortunately, scientists have already predicted, 20 years in advance, that this is our lucky day: Apophis won't hit the Earth at that time. Rest assured (pretty much). <BR> <BR>Discovered in 2004, Apophis is an asteroid about 270 meters across that orbits the Sun at distances ranging from about one astronomical unit (1 AU; the distance between Earth and the Sun) and about three quarters of an AU. Apophis orbits the Sun once every 323 days. <BR> <BR>After its initial discovery, before our knowledge of its orbital trajectory had been refined, astronomers had predicted that there was a small chance it could hit the Earth on April 13, 2029, but as we got a clearer picture of its orbit the probability dwindled to practically nothing. Instead, Apophis will pass by Earth no closer than about 18,000 miles. Whew! Disaster averted, and we didn't even have to send Bruce Willis to deal with it. <BR> <BR>But wait–that's not all. Though Apophis almost certainly won't hit us in 2029, there's a chance that this close encounter will set the asteroid up for an impact with Earth in 2036–something like 1 in 45,000. <BR> <BR>So, if we know there won't be an impact in 2029, why don't we know whether or not there will be one in 2036? Why all the suspense?</font> <BR> <BR>(because our kids/grandkids could be at risk then!!!! if gravity changes the asteroids course, and if God or Bruce Willis don't interceed.....) <BR> <BR>find out more bad news here... <BR> <BR>bad for our grandkids, <BR> <BR>and <BR> <BR>bad for the concept of a loving God of the Hebrews <BR>being in control of a benign universe "designed" for life and mankind!!! <BR> <BR><a href="http://www.kqed.org/quest/blog/2009/03/25/asteroid-apophis-hit-or-miss/" target=_top>http://www.kqed.org/quest/blog/2009/03/25/asteroid -apophis-hit-or-miss/</a>
If electricity comes from electrons, does morality come from morons?
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<font color="0000ff">Try this</font> <BR> <BR>They don't answer the question "Who created this god?". In typical christian circular reasoning they write that they don't need to answer that question because God has existed forever! Therefore, they reword it to say everything that <b>had a beginning had a 'cause'</b>. God didn't have a beginning, therefore God does not need to have a 'cause'. <BR> <BR>These guys need to quit following the script (which they admit to at the end) of Mr. Banana Man, Ray Comfort. <BR> <BR><font color="0000ff">... and before you reject it out of hand....</font> <BR> <BR>I am always interested in seeing the latest and greatest use of logical fallacies from christian apologists. That piece is one of the better examples of "How many fallacies can we fit into 10 paragraphs or less". <BR> <BR><font color="0000ff">... remember science is a manmade device</font> <BR> <BR>Has anybody ever claimed that it wasn't? <BR> <BR><font color="0000ff">... and has by it's own definitions excluded anything transcendant.</font> <BR> <BR>Nobel Prize! That's what you would win if you could show scientists how to perform studies on something that is not part of this universe. There is NO difference to anything in this universe between something that is transcendent and something that does not exist. Something that is claimed to be transcendent and something that does not exist look EXACTLY THE SAME. <BR> <BR><font color="0000ff">So does it have a right to even speculate about origins and a God:</font> <BR> <BR>"It", being the scientific method, does not speculate about gods. Science is useful for determining theories about the physical world. The bronze age writers of the Bible make many, many, many claims about the physical world including how the earth, stars, and species were formed, how long ago the universe began, how the earth behaved physically, the shape of the earth, the attributes of stars, the hydro system, catastrophic events in the recent past, the origin of races of humans, the origin of languages, the actions of shape-shifters, the cause of lightning, the cause of droughts, the cause of wind, where snow and hail come from, where the sun goes at night, why the sky is blue, how to remove leprosy from the walls of your house, the cause of infertility, how to breed striped goats, etc. <BR> <BR>Studying, scientifically, any of these things is to scientifically study the claims about the Biblical God. <BR> <BR>Does 'science' have this 'right'? <BR> <BR>Most certainly. <BR> <BR>Do scientists have a 'right' to study how the universe began or how life evolved? <BR> <BR>Most certainly. <BR> <BR>These are questions for which falsifiable tests are able to be constructed. Not only is it right to ask these questions they would be derelict in their job as scientists if they did not study these things.
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since Bob may not have read the "whole story" which he believes, he may not have heard of the "striped goats" problem, which might deserve another thread next to or under the way women are treated thread... <BR> <BR>later....when I have time... unless you, Neal, are snowbound and have the time. <BR> <BR>this is my AUC homecoming weekend, and I need to fraternize with the brotheren and sisteren and feign enjoyment of some EGW bland tasting vegan food at the cafe... and find out if they still believe semi-officially in the striped goats theory. <BR> <BR>at least this is the first year in history that they let us pay at the door on Sabbath... prior to this, even non-believers always had to arrange in advance to exchange filthy lucre on fridays for a ticket to eat at the cafe on Sabbath.... <BR> <BR>...at least the cook is allowed to light fires under the food on Sabbath without being killed. <BR> <BR>its the bland taste for which he might be said to deserve punishment.
If electricity comes from electrons, does morality come from morons?
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John, but what does that guy that says he doesn't believe in creationism say at the end of the video that you are purposely not quoting: <BR> <BR>Ian Morrison concludes by saying: <BR> <BR><blockquote><hr size=0><!-quote-!><font size=1><b>quote:</b></font><p>I don't think that science can say a God has to exist, it certainly cannot say God or a creator does not exist. <!-/quote-!><hr size=0></blockquote> <BR> <BR>That's good enough for me. An honest admission by a scientist, more than I can get from John, Neal or Elaine. His comment that God should have used an acorn instead of instant creation, is his opinion, and doesn't bother me, but that final staement is the strong statement I was looking for. <BR> <BR> <BR><a href="http://digg.com/d1iXyS" target=_top>http://digg.com/d1iXyS</a> <BR> <BR>(Message edited by Bob_2 on April 18, 2009) <BR> <BR>(Message edited by Bob_2 on April 18, 2009)
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<blockquote>I don't think that science can say a God has to exist, it certainly cannot say God or a creator does not exist.</blockquote> <BR> <BR>Why is that good enough for you? He already said that he did not believe in creationism which rules out whatever gods he thinks are possible as being the GOD of the hebrews. He KNOWS for a fact that THAT GOD does not exist. Could there be a <b>A</b> god? He says there could be. <BR> <BR>If you asked him whether unicorns exist he would also say that science cannot rule it out. <BR> <BR>Same for fairies in your back yard. Science doesn't say they definitely do NOT exist. <BR> <BR>You are mixing up the GOD you believe in with some call the "First Cause". <BR> <BR>He could be talking about the Creator Coyote of the Native Americans or the Hindu Creator God or even the God Sin or the God Amen or the God Zeus. <BR> <BR>Its not an admission by him but something that is within the realm of unproven theories of how something happened over 10 BILLION years ago. <BR> <BR>The Bible does not say anything about anything past 6 thousand years ago. <BR> <BR>Also, when you quoted the video you miscapitalized a word- god. As in "I don't think that science can say a <b><font color="ff0000">G</font></b>od has to exist...." is incorrect. It should be "I don't think that science can say a <b><font color="ff0000">g</font></b>od has to exist...."
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It rules it out for him, not for me. "Science can not say their is not a God." He may just have His techniques wrong, eh??? We can discuss that, it's guys like you that rule God out that are hard to talk to. <BR> <BR>Neal until you write Mr. Morrison about the capitalization, I am keeping it a capital G, OK. <BR> <BR>(Message edited by Bob_2 on April 18, 2009)
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<font color="0000ff">"Science can not say their</font> (sic) <font color="0000ff">is not a God."</font> <BR> <BR>I would completely agree with that statement. <BR> <BR>Scientists can, and do, state as a fact that God does not exist. However, they cannot scientifically state as a fact that <font size="+1">a</font> god does not exist or has not existed. <BR> <BR>That's the difference between the proper noun, captital G, God and other possible gods. <BR> <BR><font color="0000ff">We can discuss that, it's guys like you that rule God out that are hard to talk to.</font> <BR> <BR>The god of the Bible, God, can, and has been, falsified. The goat herders wrote a lot about what God had done, when God, did, and attributed many natural phenomena to the day-to-day intervention of their god. Its falsifiable and has been proven to be false. <BR> <BR>You are welcome to keep your capital G. I don't care if you want to be misleading about the statements of others. In fact, I would be surprised if you ever made an effort to be truthful about the intent of the statements of others.
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The "God" he speaks of is obviously NOT God. <BR> <BR>Here's a quote from your astronomer dude Ian Morison:<blockquote><hr size=0><!-quote-!><font size=1><b>quote:</b></font><p>This, of course, <font color="ff0000"><font size="+1">has allowed stable temperatures to exist on Earth for billions of years and so enabled intelligent life to <font size="+2">evolve</font></font></font>.<!-/quote-!><hr size=0></blockquote> <BR>Good quote-mining though Bob. <BR> <BR>Misleading to the ignorant, but hey, what the hey!
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<font color="0000ff">I don't think that science can say a God has to exist, it certainly cannot say God or a creator does not exist. </font> <BR> <BR>let me make a slight substitution, which will also be true, but just as meaningless: <BR> <BR><font color="ff6000">I don't think that science can say a flying spaghetti monster has to exist, it certainly cannot say FSM or its creator does not exist. </font> <BR> <BR>science cannot prove that flying saucers and flying spaghetti monsters do NOT exist.... tho the likelihood is minuscule...so one is free to believe in them too. <BR> <BR>but science CAN prove that the DOME does NOT exist... you know, the dome separating the waters on the earth from the waters in the sky? <BR> <BR>science CAN prove that the earth was NOT created in 144 hrs, just 6000 yrs ago.... <BR> <BR>which means that we need to reinterpret a few of the ancient texts....if we want to understand what "truths" they may be based on. <BR> <BR>and it means that we do not at present have all the answers...either for religion (which, unfortunately most believers will not admit), <BR>AND <BR>for science, which is what makes science the success it is....the constant search for truth, even when it means adjusting what one once believed.... which is what Religion is opposed to doing. <BR> <BR>If you have the religious truth now, why change? <BR>If you do find new light, and decide to change, doesn't that mean that you previously did not have the truth? and those whom you convinced to believe the previous truth may no longer want to follow your new truth?
If electricity comes from electrons, does morality come from morons?
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TTTHTFAL <BR> <BR>If either of you guys can give me a good reason to continue discussing with you guys on a religious forum, that God doesn't exist, which you both mock.
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Hey Bobby... U r in the <BR> <BR><b><font size="+1"><u><font color="0000ff">Evolution and Intelligent Design</font></u></font></b> <BR> <BR>section. <BR> <BR>Wake up and pay attention.
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ya..wake up <BR><a href="http://www.all-acronyms.com/RUMCYMHMD" target="_blank">...RUMCYMHMD...</a> <BR> <BR>(Message edited by john8verse32 on April 18, 2009)
If electricity comes from electrons, does morality come from morons?
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I looked at the end of the video again. <BR> <BR>Bob, he has the god of the First Cause in quotation marks. As in "God". As in, a First Cause intelligence may exist, and for convenience he put it as "God". He was not meaning God, Yahweh, Jehovah, The Divine Council of Gods from Psalms, or anything Biblical.
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