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Elaine, check out this comparison of the two accounts of the flood, and this conclusion: <BR> <BR><blockquote><hr size=0><!-quote-!><font size=1><b>quote:</b></font><p>We have examined the similarities between the Epic of Gilgamesh and Genesis flood account of the Bible. Although there are a number of superficial similarities between the accounts, the vast majority of similarities would be expected to be found in any ancient flood account. Only two similarities stand out as being unique - landing of the boats on a mountain and the use of birds to determine when the flood subsided. However, both of these similarities differ in important details. In addition, there are great differences in the timing of each of the flood accounts and the nature of the vessels. Why these details would be so drastically changed is a problem for those who claim that the Genesis flood was derived from the Epic of Gilgamesh. <BR> <BR>There are a couple possible explanations for the existence of multiple ancient flood accounts. One - that Genesis was a copy of Gilgamesh - has already been discussed and does not seem to fit the available data. The other possible explanation is that the flood was a real event in the history of mankind that was passed down through the generations of different cultures. If so, the Gilgamesh account seems to have undergone some rather radical transformations. The story is a rather silly myth that bears little resemblance to reality. In contrast, the Genesis account is a logical, seemingly factual account of a historical event. It lacks the obvious mythological aspects of the Gilgamesh epic. <BR> <BR><!-/quote-!><hr size=0></blockquote> <BR> <BR><a href="http://www.godandscience.org/apologetics/gilgamesh.html" target=_top>http://www.godandscience.org/apologetics/gilgamesh .html</a> <BR> <BR>Check out the table comparison within the article.
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Bob, I wasn't mentioning the flood in my last post; it was about creation. The Gilgamesh Epic describes the 7 days of creation almost exactly like the Genesis account. Have you read that part? <BR> <BR>As for lacking mythological aspects--have you read all of Genesis? How about the Nephilim? <BR>Talking serpent? The mysterious Melchizedek? The miraculous pregnancy of a 90-year old woman?Jacob wrestling with a god? <BR> <BR>What is your definition of myth? The dictionary definition: <font size="+1">A traditional story originating in a preliterate society, dealing with supernatural beings, ancestors, or heroes that serve as primordial types in a primitive view of the world; any real of fictional story, that appeals to the consciousness of a people by embodying its cultural ideals or by giving expression to deep, commonlhy felt emotions.</font>
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I wouldn't rely on Gilgamesh about creation if it is as absurd about the flood. How ever you wish to spend your time. But, I see it as a waste unless I am putting a paper together for a class, which is probably how you got involved with it. <BR> <BR>As for the Nephilim, I think they were why the flood happened. Talking serpent, an illusion that Lucifer certainly could accomplish. God promise a child to barren Sarah and people lived longer then, so I believe God was up to that. Whether Jacob wrestled an angel or God, he certainly was wrestling the outcome that was anticipated. You can believe the origins story of creation to be a myth if you want, for some reason I don't feel a rush to follow you down that path, I think I will continue receiving data, before I decide, thank you very much. Accepting your way, I don't like the outcome, nor does it add up, so pardon me if I don't jump down the same rabbit hole you are!!!!<img src="http://www.atomorrow.net/discus/clipart/proud.gif" border=0>
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Genesis and Enuma Elish creation myth comparisons <BR> <BR><a href="http://meta-religion.com/World_Religions/Ancient_religions/Mesopotamia/genesis_and_enuma_elish_creation.htm" target=_top>http://meta-religion.com/World_Religions/Ancient_r eligions/Mesopotamia/genesis_and_enuma_elish_creat ion.htm</a> <BR> <BR>One of the two Bible creation myths was probably derived from the much older Mesopotamian creation myth "Enuma Elish". <BR>The six days of creation in the Genesis myth parallel the six generations of gods in the Enuma Elish myth in type of god in Enuma Elish that is created (i.e. god of the earth) to what is created or happens on the corresponding day in Genesis (i.e. the waters are gathered together to expose dry land). <BR>Marduk the sixth generation god makes man as a slave so the other gods can rest. <BR>God (Elohim) makes man on the sixth day and he himself rests.
If electricity comes from electrons, does morality come from morons?
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Comparing two creation stories: <BR> <BR>Genesis 1 vs. Babylonian creation stories <BR>from: <a href="http://www.religioustolerance.org/com_geba.htm" target=_top>http://www.religioustolerance.org/com_geba.htm</a> <BR> <BR> <BR>quote: <BR>It is my understanding that Genesis' motifs and characters, God, Adam, Eve, the Serpent, and Noah, are adaptations and transformations of characters and events occurring in earlier Near Eastern Myths. In some cases several characters and motifs from different myths have been brought together and amalgamated into Genesis' stories. 2 <BR> <BR>He quotes W.G. Lambert: <BR> <BR>"The authors of ancient cosmologies were essentially compilers. Their originality was expressed in new combinations of old themes, and in new twists to old ideas." <BR> <BR>I believe Lambert's observation can be applied to the Hebrews who were combining old themes and putting "new twists" to old ideas. My research indicates that, at times, "reversals" are occurring in the Hebrew transformation and re-interpetation of the Mesopotamian myths. These "reversals," as I call them, can take the form of different characters, different locations for the settings of the stories, and different morals being drawn about the nature of God and Man's relationship. <BR> <BR>De la Torre concludes that Genesis 1-11: <BR> <BR>"... appears to be a reformatting of motifs and characters from four Mesopotamian myths: <BR> <BR> Enuma Elish has the closest parallels with the first creation story in Genesis. <BR> <BR>Wikipedia comments that the ancient Hebrews did not simply adopt the Babylonian myths; they sometimes inverted them in order to fit into their worldview. Two examples are: 3 <BR> <BR> In the Babylonian myth, the serpent, Ningishzida, is a friend to Adapa who helps him in his search for immortality. <BR> In Genesis, the serpent is the enemy of Adam, trying to trick him out of the chance to understand good and evil by developing a moral sense and thus becoming fully human. <BR> <BR>Also: <BR> <BR> The Mesopotamians had adopted a worldview in which the Earth had gradually improved since creation. <BR> The ancient Hebrews adopted a worldview in which the universe was created perfect but degenerated to the point where God had to initiate the largest genocide in history -- killing every person from newborn to the elderly in the flood of Noah. <BR> <BR> <BR> <BR>Comparison of Genesis' first Creation Story with Enuma Elish, a Babylonian creation story <BR>The Babylonian creation story is called by its first two words "Enuma Elish." According to archaeologists, it was originally written circa 1120 BCE. It was discovered in 1875 CE. It bears many points of similarity to the first creation story in the Bible: 1 <BR> <BR>Item Jewish Creation Story Babylonian Creation Story <BR>Source Genesis 1:1 to 2:3 <BR>Enuma Elish <BR>Date of writing (liberal belief) 8th or 9th century BCE Late 12th century BCE <BR>Date of writing (conservative belief) 13th century BCE, the time of Moses Late 12th century BCE. <BR> <BR>Bible:Author (liberal belief) "P," authors of the Priestly tradition. <BR>Enuma Elish:Unknown. <BR> <BR>Bible:Author (conservative belief) Moses. EE:Unknown. <BR> <BR>Bible:Creator(s) of the universe A single God, YHVH. <BR>EE: A God battling a Goddess. <BR> <BR>Bible:Initial state of the earth Desolate waste; covered in darkness. <BR>EE: Chaos; enveloped in darkness. <BR> <BR>Bible: First development Light created. <BR>EE: first developemnt:Light created. <BR> <BR>Bible:Next development Firmament created - a rigid dome over the earth separating the earth and heaven. <BR>EE: next development: Firmament created; also perceived as a rigid dome. <BR> <BR>Bible:Next development Dry land created. <BR>EE: next development: Dry land created. <BR> <BR>Bible: Next development Sun, moon, stars created. <BR>EE: next development Sun, moon, stars created. <BR> <BR>Bible: Next development Creation of men and women. <BR>EE: next development Creation of men and women. <BR> <BR>Bible:Final development God rests and sanctify the Sabbath. <BR>EE: final development...the Gods rest and celebrate. <BR> <BR>The many points of similarity between the two traditions is conclusive proof that one story was derived from the other (or that both were derived from a still older original). <BR> <BR>According to liberal theologians, the Babylonian account of creation was written in the 12th century BCE, centuries earlier than the Biblical account. According to conservative Christian theologians, the opposite happened: the Babylonian account was written after the Biblical account. <BR>end quote <BR> <BR>but the fact is the Hebrews were held captive in Babylon...and had access to read the cuniform libraries there, to learn the Babylonian myths, <BR>and adopt and adapt them to their family history. <BR>(Sargons reed basket a thousand years earlier than Moses story?) <BR> <BR>the Babylonians were NOT held captive in Judea to learn the Hebrew myths.
If electricity comes from electrons, does morality come from morons?
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